Replay: Sacred Times and Places
Five years ago, I wrote a post called “Sacred Times and Places.” The post was some thoughts that were inspired by an article written by another blogger. The question I’m considering is this: If God is everywhere at all times, then why do some people seem to sense (or hear) him more at certain times and certain places. Thinking through this question can help us help others.
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Sacred Times and Places
Phil at “Square No More” recently posted a blog called “The Christians and the Pagans Meet for Samhain” as part of the Halloween synchroblog. He says:
Sacred spaces, and sacred times are not terribly important to me. One day is like any other, and one place like another. Some of you reading this will be appalled to hear that the Vatican is no more holy to me than a dumpster. Now this does not mean that I do not appreciate fine Cathedrals, or beautiful Abbeys and Chapels. Rather it means that I believe God can manifest His gracious presence anywhere He so chooses, and He is not impressed by places and times, but instead by humble human hearts…
Yet, human hearts often attach greater importance to one place, or time over another, and I believe that there is a God in this universe Who loves people so desperately that the Divine presence of love, grace, and power will appear to those who yearn for it. Sometimes that search for God in sacred times and spaces yields results not because God honors the place, but the yearning hearts which go there.
I believe that Phil is making a distinction that is very beneficial, and one that we should consider carefully. From Scripture, we know that God does not dwell in buildings and that God is not more present at certain times and days. Yet, we cannot neglect the fact that throughout history people have come into the presence of God in specific places on specific days at specific times. When these occurrences become regular (as in Sunday mornings, for example), it is easy to believe that this time (and certain places) are somehow more holy than others.
Since God’s presence is not limited to certain places and times, why do some people sense his presence or meet with him primarily at certain places and times? By Scripture, we know that this is not an indication of the limit of the presence or activity of God. Instead, as Phil points out in the quote above, finding God primarily at certain places and times is more of an indication of when and where people are actively seeking God.
Even though God is present in all locations, on all days, at all times, and in all situations, people are not always seeking God’s presence and they are not always listening to his voice. People are not always attempting to live by the Spirit of God, in spite of the fact that the Spirit of God is always present. Even those who are followers of Christ are intermittent in the desire to hear and heed the voice of God.
Thus, discipleship in the area of seeking God and following the Spirit of God should take a two-pronged approach. First, we should recognize that people are not always seeking God. Therefore, we should recognize when people are seeking God and encourage them during those times. If someone believes that God is especially present at a certain place, on a certain day, and at a certain time, then we should encourage them to focus on God in that situation. In reality, the person is admitting that they have finally tuned into God as he has been communicating with them. The communication from God did not begin in that moment, but the reception by the individual may have begun in that moment. We should be ready to encourage listening and obeying at that moment.
Second, however, encouraging someone to listen to God at special places and in special times should not be the extent of our discipleship in this respect. As people hear from God and begin to obey him during special occasions, we should teach and demonstrate that God also communicates at other times and in other places. Primarily, this discipleship takes the form of teaching people how to hear the God who is already communicating. Of course, in a person’s life, there are many voices vying for attention. So, in order to teach people how to hear from God at all times and in all places, we should help them recognize the various sources of interference, including the systems of this world, demonic forces, and even their own desires, lusts, pleasures, goals, dreams, etc.
So, there may be sacred times and places in the sense that there may be times and places where people are more likely to attempt to hear God. However, there are no sacred times and places in the sense that God is especially present or especially communicative. As we teach people who God is, as we disciple them as followers of Christ, we should include encouragement to listen for the voice of God at all times and in all places.
What does it mean to admonish?
In yesterday’s post, “The Unmentionable One Anothers,” I listed several “one another” instructions that we prefer not to think about, that we prefer to shift off to others, that we would rather not have as our own responsibilities toward one another.
In this post, I’d like for think about the instruction “admonish one another.” According to the dictionary, “admonish” means “1) Warn or reprimand someone firmly or 2) Advise or urge (someone) earnestly.”
We find this instruction in a couple passages of Scripture. In Colossians, Paul says that “admonishing” is one of the things that he does to help the church, and he says that it’s one of the ways all believers should respond when “the word of Christ dwells in [them]”:
Him we proclaim, warning [admonishing] everyone and teaching everyone with all wisdom, that we may present everyone mature in Christ. (Colossians 1:28 ESV)
Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God. (Colossians 3:16 ESV)
The two verbs highlighted above (one translated “warning” and the other translated “admonishing”) are actually the same verb – the one that is often translated “admonish.”
Similarly, when Paul wrote to the believers in Rome, he said that he knew that they had all they needed to admonish one another:
I myself am satisfied about you, my brothers, that you yourselves are full of goodness, filled with all knowledge and able to instruct [admonish] one another. (Romans 15:14 ESV)
Again, the highlighted verb above is the one normally translated “admonish,” and is a different verb from the one normally translated “teach” or “instruct.”
Finally, we see that Paul includes “admonishing” in the work of leaders among the church and in the work of all “brothers and sisters”:
We ask you, brothers, to respect those who labor among you and are over [lead] you in the Lord and admonish you, and to esteem them very highly in love because of their work. Be at peace among yourselves. And we urge you, brothers [and sisters], admonish the idle, encourage the fainthearted, help the weak, be patient with them all. (1 Thessalonians 5:12-14 ESV)
There are a few others passages in which one or more people are said to admonish others.
But, what does it mean to admonish? How do we admonish someone while still loving them? How do we admonish someone without “lording it over them”? How do we admonish someone without taking the place of Jesus Christ in their life?
Do you know how to make disciples?
Chuck at “Being Filled” has written a very good post called “What about the Other Great Commissions?” Chuck’s title, of course, refers to the “Great Commission” in Matthew 28:19-20 and the OTHER commissions given by Jesus found in the other three Gospels and Acts. Neither of them are word-for-word copies of the others, but they all have the same thrust. (Perhaps this shows that there was not just one commission, and that the sending was more important than we even think since it was repeated by Jesus to different people on different occasions?)
But, Chuck’s post ends where I want to begin. Because he ends his post asking a very good question and offering (in my opinion) some very good answers to his question.
Chuck writes:
Besides all that, it seems to me that we’ve totally distorted this commission anyway. Jesus never said, “Go preach to the lost, lead them through a prayer, then recommend a good church.”
No! He said, “Make disciples.”
Do you know how to make disciples?
“Love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.”
“Love your neighbor as yourself.”
“Teach… them to observe everything [Jesus] commanded.”
As I’ve said before, “Disciples follow Jesus.” It really is that simple. How do we “make disciples”? By helping each other follow Jesus.
And, like Chuck says, that includes loving God, loving others, and helping each other obey Jesus.
Do you know how to make disciples? Are you making disciples?
Replay: Gospel, Community, and Sermons
Two and a half years ago, I wrote a post called “More Gospel, Community, and Sermons.” The post was actually a follow-up to another one called “Another Word About the Sermon.” Both posts were inspired by a conversation that I had with a friend about a certain book and about sermons. The point in this post is to encouraging teaching through life-example along with teaching through words.
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More Gospel, Community, and Sermons
Last week, I quoted Tim Chester and Steve Timmis’ book Total Church: A Radical Reshaping around Gospel and Community (see my post “Another Word About the Sermon“). When I found that quote, I also found that I had marked these two passages from the same book:
James says, “Do not merely listen to the word, and so deceive yourselves. Do what it says” (James 1:22). We must not only listen to the word – we must put it into practice. Churches are full of people who love listening to sermons. But sermons count for nothing in God’s sight. We rate churches by whether they have good teaching or not. But James says great teaching counts for nothing. What counts is the practice of the word. What counts is teaching that leads to changed lives. We must never make good teaching an end in itself. Our aim must be good learning and good practice. And that is a radically different way of evaluating how word-centered we are. (pg. 116)
Let us make a bold statement: truth cannot be taught effectively outside of close relationships. The reason is that truth is not primarily formal; it is dynamic. The truth of the gospel becomes compelling as we see it transforming lives in the rub of daily, messy relationships. (pg. 188)
Think about it this way: our teaching by mouth (whether lecture, dialogue, discussion, or other method) is ineffective if it is not accompanied by teaching by example and practice. I can teach by mouth, “Love one another,” and I can even get everyone to memorize the command, “Love one another.” But, neither of these indicate that I have truly taught “Love one another” or that anyone has truly learned “Love one another.”
My words “Love one another” must be accompanied by real actions demonstrating “Love one another”. Note that when I said “teaching by example and practice” above, I did NOT mean giving verbal illustrations. Verbal illustrations are simply another way to teaching by mouth. Instead, I must teach people with my life. So, it is imperative that my teaching be done in the context of real, life-sharing relationships.
I’ve offered several examples from Paul in the past, particularly from 1 Thessalonians 2:8-10 and 2 Timothy 3:10-11. However, there is also a very powerful example from Jesus in the Gospel of John:
Jesus, knowing that the Father had given all things into his hands, and that he had come from God and was going back to God, rose from supper. He laid aside his outer garments, and taking a towel, tied it around his waist. Then he poured water into a basin and began to wash the disciples’ feet and to wipe them with the towel that was wrapped around him… When he had washed their feet and put on his outer garments and resumed his place, he said to them, “Do you understand what I have done to you? You call me Teacher and Lord, and you are right, for so I am. If I then, your Lord and Teacher, have washed your feet, you also ought to wash one another’s feet. For I have given you an example, that you also should do just as I have done to you. (John 13:3-5, 12-15 ESV)
Jesus taught with his words and with his actions. We need to do likewise.
Remember that Chester and Timmis said, “Our aim must be good learning and good practice. And that is a radically different way of evaluating how word-centered we are.” How would we measure “good learning and good practice”?
Is a theological disagreement a stumbling block?
In 1 Corinthians 8 and Romans 14, Paul asks his readers to care more about their brothers and sisters in Christ than in claiming their own freedoms in Christ. In those passages, Paul was talking about theological disagreements. By claiming their rights in these areas of theological disagreement, they could make themselves into stumbling blocks for their brothers and sisters in Christ.
But, does that mean that any theological disagreement is a stumbling block? No.
Now, don’t misunderstand me. Any theological disagreement (any disagreement actually – even a disagreement that we might think is minor or trivial) MIGHT be a cause of stumbling. But, disagreements are not causes of stumbling in and of themselves.
It’s entirely possible – and it happens all the time – that two Christians can disagree without one causing the other to stumble. It’s possible – and it happens all the time – that one follower of Jesus can offend another without either one causing the other to stumble.
When Paul writes about one person causing another to stumble in 1 Corinthians 8 and Romans 14, he’s talking about something particular. Look at these passages from those chapters:
For if your brother is grieved by what you eat, you are no longer walking in love. By what you eat, do not destroy the one for whom Christ died. So do not let what you regard as good be spoken of as evil. (Romans 14:15-16 ESV)
Do not, for the sake of food, destroy the work of God. Everything is indeed clean, but it is wrong for anyone to make another stumble by what he eats. It is good not to eat meat or drink wine or do anything that causes your brother to stumble. The faith that you have, keep between yourself and God. Blessed is the one who has no reason to pass judgment on himself for what he approves. But whoever has doubts is condemned if he eats, because the eating is not from faith. For whatever does not proceed from faith is sin. (Romans 14:20-23 ESV)
However, not all possess this knowledge. But some, through former association with idols, eat food as really offered to an idol, and their conscience, being weak, is defiled. (1 Corinthians 8:7 ESV)
But take care that this right of yours does not somehow become a stumbling block to the weak. For if anyone sees you who have knowledge eating in an idol’s temple, will he not be encouraged, if his conscience is weak, to eat food offered to idols? And so by your knowledge this weak person is destroyed, the brother for whom Christ died. (1 Corinthians 8:9-11 ESV)
In each case above, disagreement is not the problem. Offense is not the problem. The problem is that the actions of one Christian is causing (or encouraging) another Christian to do something that he or she considers to be sin. We become a stumbling block when living out our freedom in Christ gives others justification to disobey Christ (in their own understanding).
Obviously, these are serious issues. We do not want to encourage our brothers and sisters to do anything that they would consider to be disobedience or sin. At the same time, we should recognize that all disagreements are not stumbling blocks.
Instead, we have to know our brothers and sisters in Christ and know what would be a real encouragement for them and what would be a discouragement to them.
By your knowledge, this weak brother or sister is destroyed
Paul begins a section (1 Corinthians 8-10) of his first letter to the Corinthians by stating, “Knowledge puffs up, but love builds up.” As Francis Bacon once said, “Knowledge is power.” Unfortunately, according to Paul, knowledge without love is powerfully destructive. Certainly, love can work within a framework of knowledge, but we should never approach one another from knowledge alone without love.
The following verse falls within that same section – a section in which Paul is teaching about living with and accepting one another in spite of theological differences:
And so by your knowledge this weak person is destroyed, the brother for whom Christ died. (1 Corinthians 8:11 ESV)
Later in this same letter, Paul will tell the Corinthians that if they do anything without love – even if they are working through a gift of the Holy Spirit without love – then their actions are worthless and done in vain. This is a strong statement, and I am glad that I did not make it. But, Paul made it very clear: our interaction with one another should always be done out of love and concern for one another. If we are “right” or correct about our fact but unloving, then we are wrong.
How does this connect to helping people follow Jesus Christ as his disciples? Well, in following Jesus, we all make mistakes. From time to time, everyone stops following him – even if for a brief moment – and we all require correction or rebuke from our brothers and sisters in Christ to help us get back on the right track.
When writing to the disciples in the region of Galatia, Paul reminds them to help those who are caught in some trespass. In this passage to the believers in Corinth, we see that this help cannot come from our knowledge alone. If we approach people only from our knowledge – we are right, and they are wrong- then we may end up “destroying” someone’s life. But, if we approach the person out of love for that individual, we build that person up instead of destroying him or her.
In knowledge, we seek to prove that we are right. But, in love, we have another goal. This section of 1 Corinthians mentioned above contains very important lessons about dealing with our brothers and sisters out of love instead of knowledge. For example, Paul acknowledges that there is no problem eating food sacrificed to idols because idols are nothing. However, he says that if this practice bothers one of his brothers or sisters, then he will never eat meat again! We may think that would be a drastic step to take. But Paul thinks it is worth giving up meat in order to help someone else follow Christ.
Paul could deal with this brother or sister out of his knowledge, telling them that he is free to eat meat offered to idols and continuing to eat that meat. However, he refuses to consider his own freedom in Christ, and, instead, makes himself a servant to that other disciple. He knows that his knowledge could cause problems to someone else, so he decides to respond in love, caring more about the other believer than himself.
Why? Because Paul knows what his goal is. His goal is not to live in his own freedoms. His goal is to help others follow Jesus Christ and to become more mature in him.
Learning to trust what God can do
The man’s son was possessed by a demon. The boy could not talk. He would occasionally have seizures, be tossed around, foam at the mouth, grind his teeth, and lay rigid on the ground. The father had tried every option, but no one could help him. So, he brought his son to Jesus. Unfortunately, when he got there, Jesus, Peter, James, and John were on top of a mountain.
Jesus’ followers – the remaining nine apostles and probably others as well – tried to cast the demon out of the boy, but it did not work. The demon remained and continued to cause the boy physical, mental, and emotional distress. Once again, the father’s hopes were dashed. But, then, Jesus came back down the mountain with Peter, James, and John.
The boy’s father had another decision to make. So far, all of his attempts at alleviating his son’s problems had proved futile. Nothing helped. But, something inside him told him to trust this man who was walking down the mountain. Something inside him told him that this man could help. It wasn’t rational; it wasn’t reasonable. Everything and everyone else screamed out that the boy’s situation was hopeless. But, there was that one voice that continued to encourage the man to hope, to trust, to ask.
While the crowd continued to argue about who was to blame for the failure to help the boy, the father rushed up to Jesus. He tells Jesus what had already happened. “Can you really help my son?” he pleads.
Jesus responds mysteriously, “All things are possible to the one who believes – has faith – trusts…” (Mark 9:23)
The father answers hurriedly, then thoughtfully, “Of course, I have faith… help me with my lack of faith.” (Mark 9:24)
After Jesus casts the demon out of the boy, I can imagine the joy and gratitude of both the father and the son as they rush home to tell their relatives. What amazing power this man had demonstrated! Look at how he had cast out the demon and restored the boy! Trust him!
But, what about Jesus’ followers? Did this miracle cause them to trust Jesus more also? Well, according to Mark, they continued to argue and ask, “Why could we not cast the demon out of the boy?” It seems that they missed the most important lesson of this episode.
Instead of observing what Jesus had done and learning to trust him, they were more concerned with their own inability to cast the demon out of the boy. Within this short episode, we should recognize that Jesus responds positively to the man who admits his own lack of faith, but he responds negatively to his followers who only seemed to be interested in what they could or could not do themselves.
When we are trusting God, we recognize that there are limits to our faith, and we ask him for help with those limits. When we are trusting God, we are not as concerned with what we can or cannot do, but are learning to trust in what God can do.
Strong words from Jesus… about us?
We all know that Jesus had strong words for the Jewish religious leaders of his day. For an example, consider the “woes” that Jesus spoke against the Pharisees, scribes, and other religious leaders in Matthew 23. He used such strong terms as “blind guides,” “hypocrites,” “whitewashed tombs,” and “serpents.” These are not the kinds of terms that would help Jesus win friends and influence people. And, none of us want Jesus to use these kinds of terms to refer to us.
But, did you know that Jesus did not reserve “strong words” only for those hypocritical religious leaders?
Primarily, I write for audience of people who are followers of Jesus, disciples, believers, Christians, those who are saved, indwelled by the Holy Spirit, and children of God.
And… here’s the part that we don’t talk about much… Jesus often spoke “strong words” toward people who were seeking the truth from him, toward those who were following him, and even toward those who he had chosen as apostles. (And, I’m not even going to include Judas Iscariot in this…)
Jesus was surprised at their lack of understanding:
But Peter said to him, “Explain the parable to us.” And he [Jesus] said, “Are you also still without understanding?” (Matthew 15:15-16 ESV)
Jesus answered him, “Are you the teacher of Israel and yet you do not understand these things?” (John 3:10 ESV)
He made demands on them:
And when Jesus came to the place, he looked up and said to him, “Zacchaeus, hurry and come down, for I must stay at your house today.” (Luke 19:5 ESV)
Now when Jesus saw a crowd around him, he gave orders to go over to the other side. And a scribe came up and said to him, “Teacher, I will follow you wherever you go.” And Jesus said to him, “Foxes have holes, and birds of the air have nests, but the Son of Man has nowhere to lay his head.” Another of the disciples said to him, “Lord, let me first go and bury my father.” And Jesus said to him, “Follow me, and leave the dead to bury their own dead.” (Matthew 8:18-22 ESV)
He made seemingly impossible demands of them:
And when it grew late, his disciples came to him and said, “This is a desolate place, and the hour is now late. Send them away to go into the surrounding countryside and villages and buy themselves something to eat.” But he answered them, “You give them something to eat.” (Mark 6:35-37 ESV)
And the Lord said, “If you had faith like a grain of mustard seed, you could say to this mulberry tree, ‘Be uprooted and planted in the sea,’ and it would obey you.” (Luke 17:6 ESV)
He rebuked them sometimes calling them names, sometimes using sarcasm and exaggeration:
And he said to them, “Why are you afraid, O you of little faith?” (Matthew 8:26 ESV)
But he turned and said to Peter, “Get behind me, Satan! You are a hindrance to me.” (Matthew 16:23 ESV)
“And I begged your disciples to cast it out, but they could not.” Jesus answered, “O faithless and twisted generation, how long am I to be with you and bear with you?” (Luke 9:40-41 ESV)
Now, some may disagree with how I’ve labeled some of the passages above. But, it’s clear that Jesus used strong words when speaking with his disciples. In the same way, he could (and probably does) use strong words when speaking with us, too.
I think the only ones who are surprised at Jesus’ strong words to us (his disciples) would be those who think they’ve got it all together… But, I could be wrong.
What do you think?
Consensus among the church… just wishful thinking?
- Introduction
- Episcopal
- Presbyterian
- Congregational
- Scriptural Evidence
- The Problem
- Moving Forward
- From Experience
A couple of year ago, I wrote a series on the topic of Church Polity. You can see the links to the posts in that series above.
In almost every instance, the question of polity arises in the context of making decisions as a church. Occasionally, the concept of polity is also seen as overlapping the issue of authority among the church. In that series, I first stepped through the definitions, scriptural evidences, and scriptural problems with the concepts of Episcopal, Presbyterian, and Congregational polities (governments).
I suggested that when turning to Scripture to support any of these polities, there are problems:
So far, in order to support any type of church polity, we must ignore the fact that there is no direct evidence, ignore passages that indicate indirectly other forms of church polity, and ignore the fact that polity is not important in any of the writings of the New Testament.
But, there is one more thing that we must ignore exegetically. We must ignore what Scripture says about all believers; things like the fact that all believers are indwelled by the Holy Spirit or all believers have the mind of Christ. We must ignore the fact that believers are to submit to one another. (I would assume this includes leaders? Even bishops? Even the presbyters?) We must ignore that believers are to consider others (and the opinions and desires of others) as more important than themselves. (I would assume this would include the majority versus the minority.)
Then, I suggested that there is another way forward, a way that does not include episcopal, presbyterian, or congregational polity: consensus. I admitted that seeking consensus among a group of believers can be impractical and often time consuming. But, still, I believe that consensus – the entire church working together to come to a decision – best describes what we read about the church in Scripture.
Recently, I noticed that the series above gets quite a few hits (through various search engines). People reach that series by searching for “episcopal church polity,” or “presbyterian church polity,” or “congregational church polity.” Sometimes, combined search strings such as “episcopal presbyterian congregational” hit that series.
But, you know what I haven’t noticed? Very few people are searching for information about consensus. I thought there may be a few reasons for this:
1) People are using a different term other than “consensus.”
2) People interested in consensus are not searching for information.
3) People don’t think consensus is a viable option.
(Perhaps there are other reasons as well…)
But, I wonder, what do you think about consensus? Is it possible that a group of Christians can come together and make decisions by consensus? Or, is this just wishful thinking… idealism… too impractical?
The Hard Way: Dealing with unnecessary burdens on our spiritual journey
A few years ago, my son and I joined a friend and his son on a hiking and camping trip through part of the Appalachian Trail in Pennsylvania. We planned to hike about 25 miles in 3 days, tent camping for the 2 nights that we were on the trail. At one point, during lunch on the second day, we met someone. After thinking about this encounter, I realized that it was – in some ways – a parallel to my spiritual journey. I shared the story with my friend Dan from “Some Church Stuff.” He said the story paralleled his own spiritual journey in a different way. He also said that he was going to steal my story and write a post of his own. So, before Dan took credit for my story in his post “The Wrong Way,” I thought I would publish something about this story too.
While we were getting ready for our hike, we loaded our backpacks with tents, sleeping bags, food, clothes, cooking utensils, more food, rain gear, camp stoves, even more food, and snacks, among other things. Altogether, between the four of us, we carried about 150 lbs on our backs as we stepped onto the Appalachian Trail. We would hike for several hours each day, then camp at night. During the second day, while we were stopped for a lunch break, a man ran up and asked if he could eat lunch with us. He was only carrying a water bladder on his back, and a small belt pouch for light food. As we talked to him, we realized that he was planning to run (yes, run) the exact same route that we were hiking. The difference: we were walking the route in 3 days while he was running that route in less than 1 day.
Now, granted, during this hiking and camping trip, my friend and I planned to spend time with our sons. It turns out that we packed way too much stuff even for this plan. And, that extra stuff weighed us down and negatively impacted our trip.
But, as I thought about the encounter with the guy who was running the trail, I started wondering… What if our plan was simply to make our way along the path? If that was our plan, then all of that stuff severely limited our ability to progress along the trail.
The other man was able to progress along the same trail faster and easier than the four of us.
As I look back on my spiritual journey, I see that I was also carrying along a lot of baggage, stuff that was hindering my progression as I desired to grow in maturity in Jesus Christ. I was told that some of this stuff was necessary. Other stuff I picked up along the way. But, in the end, I was in hindered by stuff that I thought I needed. In fact, the opposite was true – I did not need any of it.
Over the last few years, I’ve found it’s possible to make it along the trail without all of that stuff. Now, it’s true, all metaphors break down at some point. But, I’ve learned alot about myself and how God has changed my view about discipleship and following Jesus by thinking about this man that I met on the Appalachian Trail.
(Once you read my post, and understanding that this story is completely my own, jump over to Dan’s post and see what he has to say…)